I'm debating the 12m HT and there are no dealers/demos around me.

I do have a 9m Waroo and see the benefits in that size ... strong gusty winds, but even then I need to be in the mid 20's to have fun and there are still days, when steadier that I'd rather be on a C. I'm not completely convinced for the bigger sizes. I had a 14m earlier this year which I ended up selling. I found it slow and did not all that powerful unless my speed was good.

How is the HT at generating power on demand? Is there any power generated when you turn the kite or does it pivot on the wingtip without any pull? How does it behave when you edge against it? Does it shoot forward and stop pulling?

I like the idea of a reduced quiver which these new kites offer but I'm starting to think in the 12m-14m size that more of a high-depower C like the Vegas'06, Torch'07 or Tribal would be a better option. I have not flown the Torch or Tribal though.

On the other hand, looking at the deals going on right now, part of me thinks that I should pick up a couple '06 Torch's to compliment my Waroo9. I could do that for the same cost as one 12m flat kite.

190lbs riding all conditions on the NC coast. Board is 135x41.

Thoughts?

Thanks

To me the hyper didn't feel much different from my HIR's. They are flatter and fly further forward in the window which means you will not be edging as hard. This is true for any flat kite because the drag angle is reduced. When you turn it with the bar eased out, it will turn very fast and be unpowered. If you are looking to be loaded up all the time, it is probably best to stick with the C kites. In fact, buy a really old C kite with an enormous leading edge that sits so far back in the window it will take a miracle to get upwind and you need to produce 20 lbs of sideforce to generate 1 lb of thrust.

Seriously, I honestly don't know how the swept back wingtip C style kites perform compared to this SLE hybrid flatt(er) kites like the atom and hyper. If you want to be powered in a turn with the bar sheeted out then this means you are sacrificing depower in general. There isn't any magic otherwise. One thing you could consider is buying a good SLE and flying it on the slingshot bar they sell with the link. It has a very clever movable stopper ball. You can essentially convert your SLE over to a C style kite (on the fly) which maintains some level of power when you let the bar out against the stopper. When I demoed the prototype of the link, it acted goofy when I sheeted it out so I just set the stopper ball and rode it like a C style and it flew very nicely. The SLE kite will still be flatter and thus more efficient than the swept back C's, but I am not sure who complains about such things.

You could also roadtrip down to extreme kites and beg Daryl and Scott to let you demo an atom and a hyper. Dropping that kind of cash without trying something can be daunting. It is like marrying someone over the internet.

I have it easy, I just do whatever Daryl tells me to do.


-Tubby

Tony, have you looked into the Ozone Instinct? It might be exactly what you're looking for. I have yet to fly one but my friends who own them tell me they stay powered through turns and have incredible range. Maybe Scott can elaborte on this?

Just ask, that will work

I have just asked and listened to Daryl and not been led astray either for several years regarding my purchases (as a customer).



If incredible range and stability are two primary goals for your kite, the Instinct is the ticket. I have been riding the 11m in 13 knots (on a Glide) up to 30 knots with no problems. It doesn't shoot to the edge of the window quickly and then "wimp out". It also turns like a C, not on its axis, but more by "following its nose", like a C. It is more like a C with an interesting trimming technique than a hybrid, IMO.

The range on the Instinct is tryly phenomenal.

The hyper type is as close to classic C performance as I have felt with a hybrid, with the advantages of increased range and depower-ability.

In terms of buying some C-kites. Nothing wrong with C kites whatsoever.
We will continue to carry C kites.

The new SS Fuels will be out soon (one of the gold standards in Cs)
We will also have Naish, RRD and other top notch producers of C-kites

Tony,
It is a question of what you really want. If you like the pull of a C shape, then stick with a C shape. If you want to stop the pull with just a flick of the bar, then get a Bow/Hyrbrid. Even though the new RRD HT is probably the closest to a C shape, it still is a bow kite....when you push the bar away from you, most of the pull is gone. I like that feel on some occassions, but really like the constant pull of a C shape on other occasions. So, for me, I am probably going to have a mixed quiver of kites.. I am looking forward to the new RRD Type 8 or the new Slingshot Fuel.... C's aren't dead yet...

Pat,
I think you stated it best. For me it is still a compromise. I think that most days the flat kite is what I want to be on but there are still days where I'll want to pull out the C kite. Still have a couple C kites which I'll keep as backups. Used C-kites are not worth selling these days anyway.
If the HT is very clost to a C with more depower and range that is probably the right choice for me.
Can anyone comment on the range of the 9m? Would the 9m and 12m be too much overlap?
Tony